351

(2 odpowiedzi, napisanych Software, Gry - 8bit)

The software you're using (version 4.0) is effectively an alpha version (assuming it's the one using the hardware 80 column mode - it's not easy to discern from the video). It was never finished, and is doubtless full of bugs. Completing the VBXE version is one of the dozen or so jobs competing for my time right now. However, now that version 3.21 is finalized, perhaps it would be a good opportunity to code up a VBXE version. :)

352

(106 odpowiedzi, napisanych Fabryka - 8bit)

Have a look over at the Atari Age forum to see how the project is progressing. I considered it more important to make significant progress on the core code than release frequent demos. I am currently working on a resource manager (having done a complete re-write of the menu manager) and when this is closer to completion I will release another demo for people to play with. It will demonstrate a movable/sizeable window with a complete set of controls, as well as the menu system and some static icons on the desktop.

353

(106 odpowiedzi, napisanych Fabryka - 8bit)

Pin napisał/a:

Pamiętaj, że mamy - powiedzmy że 1.77Mhz i podejście do tematu grafiki bitowej od strony jeszcze dodatkowego sterownika finalnie na ekranie wyglądać może jak oglądanie filmu, gdzie na każdą sekundę przypada 2 klatki :D - To tak, jak byś chciał napisać cieniowanie Gourauda w Basicu. Wcale nie mówię, że się nie da. Da się - pytanie tylko jaki otrzymamy efekt finalny.

Nie neguję oczywiście chęci, lub tego co można ciekawego zrobić, bo różne niemożliwe cuda miałem okazję na Atari widywać - wszelako; chętnie pobawię się produktem finalnym ;)-

Where's the question? Have you actually looked at this? :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpx0gUpwyQo

OK - it's a menu. But there's a lot of processing going on there. I'm not saying that the finished product is going to run as fast as Windows. It would be insanity to expect such things. But it ought to be fast enough. I have not yet produced any slide shows... ;)

354

(106 odpowiedzi, napisanych Fabryka - 8bit)

Pin napisał/a:

wieczor :) - nic nie mówię, lecz wydaje mi się, iż dostosowanie GUI ze zwykłego Atari do pracy pod VBXE oznacza jego napisanie od zera :)

What - rewriting the whole GUI from scratch? I have around 2,500 lines of code, and only 500 lines of code (those in the GFX.S module) are concerned with drawing to the screen. And of those 500 lines of code, there are about 20-30 direct writes to the screen RAM. Moreover, GFX.S hasn't grown in size for weeks (while GUILIB.S grows exponentially). There is much more to a GUI than drawing lines and blitting. The bulk of the system is all about object manipulation.

wieczor napisał/a:

A skadze znowu. To tylko kwestia zalozen przy tworzeniu i o to wlasnie chodzi - zanim zacznie sie tworzyc. GUI to nie stawianie pikseli na ekranie, czy rysowanie okien a do tego sprowadza się kwestia sterownika.

Jesli zaczniesz robic GUI koncentrujac sie na rysowaniu, to nie osiagniesz sukcesu bo to jest samo dno hierarchii kodu, zaplaczesz sie w szczegolach technicznych. Dlatego takie rzeczy robi sie dwuwarstwowo - tworzy sie biblioteke operacji ekranowych a nastepnie logike ktora z nich korzysta. Zmiana urzadzenia - to zmiana biblioteki. Przeciez GUI ma robic znacznie wiecej nic narysowac okienko.

Exactly so. Most of the GUI operations are reducible to:

- Clear an area of the screen
- Move an area of the screen to a back-buffer
- Move buffered background data back to the screen
- XOR an area of the screen
- Draw a horizontal/vertical line
- Blit a bitmap to the screen (an icon or alpha character)

This is all pretty straightforward and re-usable code (e.g. the code to draw boxes and drop-shadow boxes simply calls the draw horizontal/vertical line routine a few times). To implement VBXE support, one would change the clipping limits, re-write PARTS of GFX.S, replace certain code with blitter operations, etc. Not a trivial task, but probably only a month's work.

As for drivers, why on earth would I concern myself with a device independent screen driver when I'm writing a GUI for an Atari 8-bit? 99.9% of these machines have a fixed 1bpp 320x192 display. Why overload screen draw operations with multiple levels of indirection, varying screen dimensions, etc, just to have a system which runs sluggishly but which is easier to convert for VBXE use?

The fact is, it would be better to regard GFX.S as the "driver", and to think in terms of "draw line", "render bitmap", and "clear screen area" as the lowest-level operations. There are half a dozen such operations at the moment, and this code is all we need to re-write to implement support for VBXE modes.

Programujac liniowo albo nie zrobi sie tego w ogole albo zajmie to lata, a i tak sledzenie bledow bedzie koszmarem. Wszystko jest kwestia kompromisu

Well said. Of course the "proper" way would be to render everything at the pixel level and simply implement a driver which provides the low-level interaction with the screen. But this is an Atari 8-bit with a 6502 processor. I said at the start that the GUI would have to employ "techniques normally seen in games and demos". How many demos draw to the screen using the CIO? :D

355

(106 odpowiedzi, napisanych Fabryka - 8bit)

@wieczor: most of the screen handling for the UI (clearing window areas, drawing frames, etc) bypasses pixel-level operations and works directly with the screen RAM. As I've said elsewhere, it's simply essential for the sake of speed. Drawing primitives (circles, diagonal lines, flood fills, etc) will be a completely separate concern. Indeed, depending on how much room the UI consumes (at the moment, it's about 6KB of code), the drawing library could be loaded solely by those apps which require it (e.g. a drawing program), otherwise it's just taking up space 90% of the time.

Naturally, with successive optimisations, "draw dialogue" and "draw window" will share the same base code. I'm starting to write all the dialogue controls now, and this means designing structures for the header file, writing all the methods, expanding the dispatcher. It will take months of steady progress. :)

356

(106 odpowiedzi, napisanych Fabryka - 8bit)

VBXE modes would obviously solve a lot of problems (such as representing a 72dpi document on the screen), but the objective is to get something working on standard hardware first. Of course it's fairly easy to add VBXE support later: amend masking and screen RAM write routines, and adjust the size of the root (SCREEN) object in memory. But naturally when you introduce device independence, you introduce an overhead. "JSR write_byte" is many cycles slower than "STA (SCR),Y". Let's get the basics out of the way first. In any case, with VBXE's blitter, it would be difficult NOT to write a fast and responsive GUI. Or one could just use an ST. :)

Pin's meaning is especially hard to translate, ;) but SDX plus GUI is a match made in heaven. The system will use the full features of the Sparta FS, and will have a clock-widget in the top-right corner of the screen. You'll double-click on it to set the system time. Drag and drop files(s) from one folder to another. The usual basic GUI stuff.

Cartridge or files? Who knows. I'll make the best practical decision after taking everything into account. All my software has always been free. If it's on a cart, you'll have to buy yourself a flashable cart and flash the GUI onto it. It's it's on disk, there is zero financial outlay. :)

Cascading menus are now finished, and I've started the window/dialogue render routines, and the rest of the event handler. It will take several weeks to code up all the controls (scroll bars, text boxes, list boxes, buttons, etc, etc).

357

(106 odpowiedzi, napisanych Fabryka - 8bit)

Hopefully it will work with MyIDE/SIDE - much depends on whether the core library is placed on a cartridge.

358

(106 odpowiedzi, napisanych Fabryka - 8bit)

The new GUI will be able to launch "legacy" applications and return to the desktop. It's a pretty essential feature. I should have listed that in the specifications. :)

359

(106 odpowiedzi, napisanych Fabryka - 8bit)

Polish doesn't come across very well in Google Translation, but TRS desktop is very impressive. So is Boss-X. The new GUI is not in any way in competition with these two products. It will, however, offer a complete API for programmers. The idea is that the application has a unified GUI "look and feel", and interacts with the user only via calls to the API. It has a full object heirarchy (like Contiki), widgets, fonts in various sizes, scrollable windows, etc, etc. All applications will have the same skeletal framework. The GUI is in machine code and is totally language independent. It can sit on a cartridge or go under the OS.

I wanted to write GUI applications for the Atari but I couldn't find anything which provided an API for programs. Diamond came close to what I wanted, but lacks several important components. Therefore I'm writing it myself. :)

360

(106 odpowiedzi, napisanych Fabryka - 8bit)

Thanks for the encouragement. There should be a demo with a dialogue box and some draggable icons in the next few weeks.

361

(106 odpowiedzi, napisanych Fabryka - 8bit)

Official announcement of the new GUI project for the A8:

http://www.atari8.co.uk

362

(27 odpowiedzi, napisanych Sprzęt - 8bit)

http://www.atari8.co.uk/downloads/HDSC_32MB.jpg

363

(27 odpowiedzi, napisanych Sprzęt - 8bit)

Here's a benchmark test using dual Compact Flash cards:

SpartaDOS X 4.43RC, dual 256MB, 80x Transcend Compact Flash cards, drive C: on disk 0, drive M: on disk 1.

Copying a 1,329K (1.29MB) file from partition C: to partition M: 49 seconds (26.58 KB/s).

Assuming SDX is using a ~30K copy buffer, that's about 44 burst reads/writes.

364

(25 odpowiedzi, napisanych Sprzęt - 8bit)

MyIDE with SDX driver and KMK/IDEa (they fight for superiority).

XM301/SIO2SD conversion with built-in SIO2PC for moving data to and from PC and making HDD backups.

365

(27 odpowiedzi, napisanych Sprzęt - 8bit)

JEALOUSY.VX now plays at 11.48 FPS:

PunBB bbcode test

366

(27 odpowiedzi, napisanych Sprzęt - 8bit)

My KMK works now, so I needed a reason to use the MyIDE driver:

DOS writing: 59411.3628 B/sek
DOS reading: 71035.3252 B/sek
DOS average: 65223.344 B/sek

(Eight unrolled reads in the MyIDE driver's read loop, and four unrolled writes). :)

367

(27 odpowiedzi, napisanych Sprzęt - 8bit)

dely napisał/a:

I think, that there are few users with MyIDE-equipped setup, but it's a shame to admit "I am using MyIDE, because i'm too lame for JŻ/KMK IDE" :)

No offence, this is only joke ;)

zaxon napisał/a:

Hmm, " i use myide becouse i can't buy  JZ/KMK/Ide"  is better...

LOL. Sure, it's understandable - largely because MyIDE needs a custom SIO driver and in the past we were obliged to replace the whole Operating System ROM just to make it work.

I have KMK/IDEa (not yet working) as well. Both have their pros and cons. MyIDE is tiny, but I wouldn't want to use it with anything other than the SDX driver. IDEa takes up a lot of desk space, but it does have the cart pass-thru, etc.

Of course, there's added pleasure in using MyIDE with drivers and FDISK I wrote myself. :)

...i test both platforms and all is good  on one ,bad on second and vice versa.

This is a typical scenario. Reliability is so dependant on the Atari timings. However, same is true of unmodded KMK/IDEa...

368

(27 odpowiedzi, napisanych Sprzęt - 8bit)

JEALOUSY.VX at 10 fps:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R36TS0uZuEU

369

(1 odpowiedzi, napisanych Fabryka - 8bit)

This has been lying in a cupboard for 15 years since I wrote it in 1995. It was the first large app I'd ever written for the Atari. It's coded in Turbo Basic, but a 31K compiled version is also supplied.

http://www.atari8.co.uk/

There's no manual, but the program is pretty easy to use. I wanted to share it after all these years, having just discovered it again.

370

(27 odpowiedzi, napisanych Sprzęt - 8bit)

I'm not sure how widely used the MyIDE interface is in Europe, but a MyIDE driver for SpartaDOS X is under development:

http://www.atariage.com/forums/topic/16 … de-driver/

http://www.atari8.co.uk/

Updated driver/FDISK will be published on Sunday. The software offers:

- 512 bytes/sector
- 62KB/s DOS reads
- 58KB/s DOS writes
- up to 15 x 32MB partitions
- high compatibility with existing SDX applications
- support for S_VBXE driver (FDISK)

371

(3 odpowiedzi, napisanych Fabryka - 8bit)

Lotharek! Did you not receive email I sent you over a month ago regarding Stereo upgrade I ordered on 14/07/10? It has not been received.

Please PM me, since I can't be guaranteed to catch reply posted here.

372

(11 odpowiedzi, napisanych Fabryka - 8bit)

Cosi napisał/a:

Sure, I've figured it out. Just wanted to mention that TLW is not 100% user-proof (as no program is) :)

Indeed so! :)

pirx napisał/a:

Hey!

Please think about releasing the fileselector as a separately available package - we are here in a deep need for a decent and modern (SDX, MyDOS, etc.) FS.

It's something I would consider but it's pointeless duplicating the functionality of Sparta Commander for SDX. Perhaps a version which works with any DOS would be useful.

373

(6 odpowiedzi, napisanych Sprzęt - 8bit)

I see no C source code there. What am I doing wrong?

...it's OK. I figured it out. Been wanting to look at this source code for a long time...

374

(11 odpowiedzi, napisanych Fabryka - 8bit)

Cosi napisał/a:

I've just found a bug (?) ;)
When you press Shift-Ctrl-N (new font) and - after the prompt - type e.g. "D1:*.*", you get a pretty mess on the screen.

Hardly a bug. You're loading any old file into the font buffer. :)

<SHIFT+CTRL+H> is the only command which lets you set the filemask for the disk menu and then press return. To get a file selector after you pressed <SHIFT+CTRL+N>, press <Tab>. Sadly whatever you already typed is ignored in that case.

In the next version I will do away with typing filenames altogether: file selector by default. It will be more consistent.

375

(6 odpowiedzi, napisanych Sprzęt - 8bit)

Details here:

http://www.atariage.com/forums/topic/15 … le-format/

SIO performance is much better using 512byte sectors. SIO2SD is the primary storage device for many of us, and performance is important. Write speeds at divisor 3 are disappointing also. I understand the limitations of code space, however. :)